Posts by Cold Steel

11

What the hell is a "land?"

by stillin in

the service reports for jw's always toots their horn about all of the "lands" that the good news is being preached in.. has anybody got a clue?

how many lands are there, total?

are lands the same as countries?.

Cold Steel

I don't know, but I think one is my front yard.

19

Is JW Baptism the Only Valid Baptism?

by Cold Steel in

what is the watchtower bible and tract societys view on baptism?

is it absolutely essential that one be baptized to gain eternal life in gods kingdom?.

and can they tell you who you can and cant baptize?.

Cold Steel

What is the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society’s view on baptism? Is it absolutely essential that one be baptized to gain eternal life in God’s Kingdom?

And what is the policy on who may baptize? I understand that every baptized member of the Society is an ordained minister. But the local authorities keep a short leash on what a minister can or cannot do. The Society declares it is not a church, but if I’m a baptized Jehovah's Witness, what happens if I baptize someone who doesn’t want to be affiliated with a church or organization? Will Jehovah recognize that baptism or will he ignore it because it was not done according to the dictates of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society?

Shortly before his ascension, Jesus spoke to Peter, the chief apostle:

“And I will give unto thee the Keys of the Kingdom of Heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on Earth shall be bound in Heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on Earth shall be loosed in Heaven.” (Matthew 16:19).

These keys of authority were given to Peter by Jesus, most likely in a hands to head ordination. One could thus surmise that Peter controlled those who acted in God’s name. If someone baptized someone and was not authorized by Peter, that baptism would not be recognized in heaven. And if Peter, or those he authorized, disfellowshiped (or cut off) members in disciplinary actions, the bonds of baptism could be loosed.

This makes sense if the Lord is going to maintain a church, and the Lord told Peter that upon the “rock” of revelation, he would “build my church.” Thus, if Peter was so authorized, then how did this authorization land in the laps of Charles T. Russell or Joseph Rutherford? And how did the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society receive these keys?

This is one thing that no Jehovah's Witness has ever been able to explain to me. If the Governing Body has these keys, then yes, they can mete out the authority to baptize. They also can mete out the authority to disfellowship. When a person is baptized, it will be recognized in Heaven, and when they’re cut off, that person is cut off in Heaven.

But if they don’t have the said Keys of the Kingdom, then what is there to fear when they disfellowship someone? And can they tell you who you can and can’t baptize?

I realize that few people on this site believe that the Governing Body has any dispensational authority; however, what would be the Society’s position on this issue? And if members really do have the authority, as “ordained ministers,” to baptize, wouldn’t it be great to be able to baptize their children and other family members? Instead, baptisms tend to be done en masse. Biblically, people could receive baptism without having to wait for a conference or semi-annual meeting.

Who are these people doing the baptisms? Are they rank and file members,
elders or other office holders? If a baptized father wanted to baptize his children,
would he be allowed to do so? What if one was in Israel and wanted his best friend,
a baptized member, to baptize him in the Jordan River? Would it be permitted?

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4

Why Aren't ALL Men Created Equal?

by Cold Steel in

...and by "men" it includes women.. is it fair that some are born into "worldly" religions and are thus hell bound, while others are born into "the truth" and, if they don't apostatize, will be heaven bound (if they are so predestined) or will be part of the great flock...er...crowd.

the question of justice and fairness is rarely questioned from a god who is said to be just, fair, loving, kind, equitable, all-knowing being who not only is our god, but our father.

some are born with chronic conditions such as pain, while others are born into extreme conditions.. so my question is, why, according to the great scheme of things, aren't all given the same, fair shake in life?

Cold Steel

...and by "men" it includes women.

Is it fair that some are born into "worldly" religions and are thus hell bound, while others are born into "the truth" and, if they don't apostatize, will be heaven bound (if they are so predestined) or will be part of the great flock...er...crowd. The question of justice and fairness is rarely questioned from a God who is said to be Just, Fair, Loving, Kind, Equitable, All-Knowing Being who not only is our God, but our Father. Some are born with chronic conditions such as pain, while others are born into extreme conditions.

So my question is, why, according to the great scheme of things, aren't all given the same, fair shake in life? Does God judge on a curve? And is it really fair and just that Jehovah would come and destroy everyone who sincerely believes they are following his will, but who happened to join the wrong church or sincerely follow the wrong spiritual path? The Jehovah's Witnesses, after all, have no demonstrable pointers that would lead most seekers to their sect. There are no spiritual gifts, no prophecies that show that Jehovah would show forth his works in a latter-day publishing company.

One can blame only so much on Adam and Eve. They were created by God. But then, people come through their line and granted, there will always be the wealthy and the poor. That's man's doing. As a fallen people, we also must endure illnesses; however, when it comes to being attractive and intelligent, or ugly and stupid, or any of the variances in between, it seems that there could be more equity.

It hardly seems just.

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Yeah, I know it's Photoshop (top/left), but you get my gist. As for
the intelligent and beautiful catagory, would that God had
created more people like lovely Amanda Tapping (bottom/right).
When she smiles, it's like a light goes on in her face!

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3

Challenge Question For All JWs: Is It Scriptural For Jehovah's Witnesses To Say All The "Kings of the Earth" Will Be Destroyed At Armageddon?

by bjc2read in

especially for all "newbies" here:.

challenge question: is it scriptural for jehovah's witnesses to say all the "kings of the earth" will be destroyed at armageddon?.

you may find the following interesting to consider:.

Cold Steel

The answer is no, it's not scriptural to make such a statement.

Most Jehovah's Witnesses have no idea what Armageddon is and how it figures in prophecy. In fact, I've never met a single JW who knows what the scriptures say about it. They know what the Watchtower says about Armageddon, but even the WT writers are clueless.

10

GHOST? SPIRIT? WRAITH? What the heck is holy spirit/HOLY SPIRIT?

by Terry in

we all know people who have opinions on things they've never been educated about--but, that doesn't stop them from acting qualified, does it?

no.. from time to time i read and hear some amazing opinions spoken with confidence and authority with nothing to back all that up.. i have watched pat robertson on tv close his eyes and receive "word" from the spirit.. i have met people who "talk" with god.. obviously these kinds of above-described activities are subjective.. .

it would be like hearing about somebody else's toothache.

Cold Steel

A problem with the Jehovah's Witness’ doctrine of the Holy Spirit being only the “active force” of God is demonstrably false. “In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established,” the law says. In the New Testament, the apostles use this law of witnesses to verify the reality of the other two members of the Godhead. The Father and the Holy Spirit bear witness of the Son; the Son and the Holy Spirit bear witness of the Father, and the Father and Son both bear witness of the Holy Spirit.

Once one witness is negated as a force, a non-entity, then the law of witnesses go out the window.

The Father and the Holy Spirit both
bore witness of the Son. Since all such events
must be witnessed by two or more to be
valid, the Holy Spirit must be an intelligent
being to be able to testify.

11

want to memorize GB names?

by losingit in

saw this on fb... a little trick to remember their names.... "i herd jackson splane to morris, never lett sanderson pierce losch".

apparently jws now feel that they must memorize their names, as they are the "8 most distinguished men on earth" (a real fb comment).

followers of men, not followers of god..

Cold Steel

Twelve was a good number...why are there only eight? Aren't these guys revered as apostles? Oh, no, wait...the apostles were considered the Governing Body.

One question about these guys. When they visit the various Kingdom Halls, do they stay at hotels or with members? Do they eat at restaurants or do they eat at the homes of various members?

And what about friendships? According to the Society, members should only associate with other members. So do these GB fellows hang out only with each other or do they socialize with the rank and file Kingdom Hall nobodies? When I was a Protestant, the preacher was always invited out to dinner with his wife. In all the churches I ever attended, I don't recall the preacher ever inviting a member family over to dinner. Same thing's true with my wife's Greek Orthodox priest. He and his wife are always being invited to home and expensive Greek restaurants, most of which post photos of a whole group of Greek families with the priest and his wife (who frequently wears her full length fur coat in cold weather). No one we've asked in the church has ever, or knows of any members, being asked to dinner by the priest or his wife. Even when he goes out to lunch with members, guess who alway$ pick$ up the tab? Not the guy in the collar!

Anyhoo, I reckon the rank and file pretty much fawn over these guys when they drop by. Do they ever go door-to-door with the Pioneers while they're out attending other Kingdom Halls.

10

GHOST? SPIRIT? WRAITH? What the heck is holy spirit/HOLY SPIRIT?

by Terry in

we all know people who have opinions on things they've never been educated about--but, that doesn't stop them from acting qualified, does it?

no.. from time to time i read and hear some amazing opinions spoken with confidence and authority with nothing to back all that up.. i have watched pat robertson on tv close his eyes and receive "word" from the spirit.. i have met people who "talk" with god.. obviously these kinds of above-described activities are subjective.. .

it would be like hearing about somebody else's toothache.

Cold Steel

And with some justification. I've never liked the term "Holy Ghost," but I use it because the scriptures do. Ghost is generally defined now as "The spirit of a dead person, especially one believed to appear in bodily likeness to living persons or to haunt former habitats." Spirit, on the other hand, is defined as "The vital principle or animating force within living beings; incorporeal consciousness; the soul, considered as departing from the body of a person at death." So it's pretty much the same thing.

Still, most people on the street think of "ghosts" of being the spirits of departed people and "spirits" as incorporeal beings or finer matter. A spirit can be an unembodied being while a ghost is a disembodied being. Since the Holy Spirit has never been embodied, it doesn't seem right to many people. But according to dictionary meanings, it's six of one....

44

Who are doing Jehovah's will today? Brochure

by KateWild in

this brochure is being studied, in the org starting form this week.

it rams lies down our throats, trying to convince us the the wt is god's organisation.

it lies to us about how the wt is doing jehovah's will.. we are going to be subjected to lies, lies and more lies for weeks.

Cold Steel

Data-Dog: I refuse to read the brochure, or study it. If only my wife would feel the same. The worse things get, the more she worships the GB/Organization. I may have to get DF'd, just to shock her to her senses.

Well, if you do that, she’ll think you’re just close minded and rebellious. Any anger in the way you respond will be interpreted by them as the bitterness of apostasy. And it will be YOU who will appear as being the unreasonable one. If you appear to be open minded and read the brochure with your wife, pointing out the obvious flaws. Some of the things you can expect from her include: If the Jehovah's Witnesses are not right, then who is? Which religion most closely follows Jehovah’s doctrine and his will?

The only thing you can do is throw it back in her lap and ask her what visible aspects of the Society have ever shown themselves. Not only have none of the members of the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses ever been ordained by anyone with the keys of governance over God’s earthly Kingdom, none of them has actually seen or spoken to an angel, seen a vision or seen or spoken to Jesus. So where do they get the ministerial authority?

Jesus appeared and interacted with his servants anciently. He let them feel the prints in his hands and the wounds in his feet, and he taught them for 40 days before ascending into Heaven. If the Jehovah's Witnesses are his people today, why can’t he reveal himself to them now? If these men have had a joint revelation from angels or from Jesus, if they have the keys of the kingdom and if two or more of them can testify that it happened and that God has again spoken, then they would have some serious claims. But everything with the Jehovah's Witnesses is invisible. How can one prove something that’s invisible? Especially when the Governing Body members themselves haven’t seen or experienced anything that might be interpreted as a supernatural happenstance. They can describe these magnificent things that are “right around the corner” and put all these supernatural judgments coming down on American people and cities, but so far their predictions have come to naught, everything is invisible and just out of reach of verification. That just wasn’t the way it was in the ancient church. First century Christianity was rife with visions, dreams, healings, angelic visitations and even personal visitations of Jesus. John, on Patmos, had his vision and saw Jesus at around 96 A.D., some sixty years after Jesus’ death!

If your wife can counter the above, I’d certainly love to hear it! I’d also like to know when is something...anything...going to happen that is both accurate and visible? Much of the Jehovah's Witnesses religion is completely imaginary. Everything is in the future, no matter how many years pass. And if something disastrous finally does happens, you’re going to have many religions seeking guidance and claiming they told us so. Will the Governing Body be able to direct people during a disaster like an electromagnetic pulse attack or solar storm? Are the people who believe in the Rapture going to be standing around with their arms and hands outstretched heavenward? What can be expected from a religion that’s been consistently wrong about everything?

Ask your wife to explain why the Jehovah's Witnesses have the authority to act and speak in God’s name. I’d really like to hear her answer!

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10

GHOST? SPIRIT? WRAITH? What the heck is holy spirit/HOLY SPIRIT?

by Terry in

we all know people who have opinions on things they've never been educated about--but, that doesn't stop them from acting qualified, does it?

no.. from time to time i read and hear some amazing opinions spoken with confidence and authority with nothing to back all that up.. i have watched pat robertson on tv close his eyes and receive "word" from the spirit.. i have met people who "talk" with god.. obviously these kinds of above-described activities are subjective.. .

it would be like hearing about somebody else's toothache.

Cold Steel

What the Society puts forth is not only unscriptural, it is demonstrably false. So how did God reveal his “secrets” to his servants, the prophets? Was it an invisible Spirit that came upon them? Sometimes. Peter didn’t strike Ananias and Sapphira down (Acts 5) on his own accord. How did he know that they had “lied to God”? And by what authority did he cause them to forfeit their lives? Peter stated, “Why is it that Satan has so filled your heart that you have lied to the Holy Spirit?”

Peter was ordained by Jesus, who gave the apostles the “keys of the kingdom” to bind in Heaven and on Earth. Peter, when Jesus asked him who he, Jesus, was, replied, “Thou art the Christ, the Son of the Living God.” And Jesus said to him, “Flesh and blood hath not revealed this unto thee, but my Father which is in Heaven.”

These things all came through the Spirit of God. But Peter, the apostles, the ancient prophets—they also entertained angels and some even spoke to God directly, face to face. And though Jesus referred to the Holy Spirit as a “him,” the Jehovah's Witnesses prefer to think of him as an active force (despite the fact that there’s no such thing as an “inactive” force).

Not only were the members of the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses never ordained by God, angels, or anyone else, and having no keys of governance over God’s earthly Kingdom, none of them has actually seen or spoken to God, an angel or to Jesus. And if Jesus appeared to his servants anciently, let them feel the prints in his hands and feet and taught them for 40 days before ascending into Heaven, then why can’t he do it now? If they have had a joint revelation from angels or from Jesus and can each testify that it happened, then I’ll take them more seriously; and we can determine when and how they received the keys of authority for this dispensation. But until then—until they have shown that the spiritual gifts of the ancient church belongs in a publishing company, excuse me for saying that their claims are false and that they, themselves, are false prophets and will be regarded as such at the Judgment.

As for “sinning” against the Holy Spirit, or blaspheming him, since he is a revealer of Christ and a revelator of holy things, if you have it revealed to you that Jesus is the Christ by that Spirit, and then deny it and seek the murder of the Lord’s people, then you blaspheme against the Holy Spirit and become an eternal enemy to God. But I think that requires an irrefutable revelation to a person and then have that person turn as did the angels of Heaven in the Beginning. In other words, a person would have had to first acquire a certain knowledge, then throw it to be trampled by swine. Peter didn’t sin against the Holy Spirit when he thrice denied Christ, for he only denied an association and he had not yet been converted.

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68

Why Does this super smart Bible God not perform miracles

by confusedandalone in

let's be serious - if you really want people to have faith and to be able to now absolute truth why not perform miracles.

why not make the bible a blank book and when you open it, it addresses you personally in writing of course.

for instance it says, "hey confusedandalone this is what i need you to do.

Cold Steel

Confusedandalone: ...if you really want people to have faith and to be able to know absolute truth why not perform miracles. Why not make the bible a blank book and when you open it, it addresses you personally in writing of course.

Oh, where to start?

First, miracles don’t prove anything. According to John in the book of Revelation, many would be misled in the latter days by agents of the Adversary performing miracles. If you want to understand how these miracles will be used to deceive, read Joel Richardson’s book, The Islamic Antichrist. It’s an astounding account of how Christian/Jewish eschatology is almost identical to Islamic eschatology. The only difference is whether the major players are good guys or bad guys.

In other words, to Muslims, the great caliph of the last days will be the Mahdi, who, with Jesus Christ, will convert the world and recapture Jerusalem for Islamic rule. The Mahdi will put down the Jewish threat and “Jesus” will perform great miracles and explain to Christians how they’ve been deceived by early Christian writers who got everything wrong. To Christians, the Mahdi will be great “beast” or “antichrist,” while the Islamic Jesus will be the “false prophet,” both spoken of by John in Revelation. In both accounts, the Mahdi/Beast will enter into a 7-year peace agreement with Israel during which the Jews will be able to offer sacrifices to God. The Islamic version doesn’t mention whether the peace treaty will run its course, but Bible writers say that it will only last three and a half years. Then the Beast will turn viciously on the Jews and bring total war against them in a battle called “Armageddon.” To the Muslims it will be a time of total victory against the Jews. As Richardson notes, of the Mahdi, two Shi’a Islamic scholars write:

A figure more legendary than that of the Mahdi, the Awaited Saviour, has not been seen in the history of mankind. The threads of the world events have woven many a fine design in human life but the pattern of the Mahdi stands high above every other pattern. He has been the vision of the visionaries in history. He has been the dream of all the dreamers of the world. For the ultimate salvation of mankind he is the Pole Star of hope on which the gaze of humanity is fixed….

Another Muslim scholar writes: “The Mahdi will establish right and justice in the world and eliminate evil and corruption. He will fight against the enemies of the Muslims who would be victorious.”

But to John the Revelator, the Mahdi is controlled by Satan. According to Richardson:

Some of the various names that Scripture assigns to him are “the Beast” (Revelation 13:4), “the abomination that causes desolation” (Matthew 24:15), “the desolator” (Daniel 9:27), “the man of sin,” “the man of lawlessness,” “the son of destruction” (2 Thessalonians 2), “the little horn” (Daniel 7:8), “the Assyrian” (Micah 5:5, Isaiah 10:5, 14:25), “the oppressor,” “the king of Babylon” (Isaiah 14), and even the mysterious “Gog” (Ezekiel 38:1, Revelation 20:7). There are several other names that Scripture uses to refer to the Antichrist as well.

My point is, both God and Satan can work miracles. Both can send emissaries clothed as “angels of light.” Many will be deceived by the Beast and the False Prophet because they will be able to perform great miracles. What Jehovah's Witnesses teach about Armageddon is complete and total nonsense. They know nothing of Christian or Jewish eschatology.

Another point is that how can we live by faith when there are miracles? We are sent to Earth to be tried and tested. It’s rough, horrible at times and fearful; however, it’s necessary. As the Father could not remove the “bitter cup” from His only begotten Son, He cannot provide us with heirship without our going through earth life.

Finally, we don’t know the mechanics of miracles. If you went back in time to ancient Egypt at the time of Abraham and showed them a 1000-lumen flashlight that could also flash red, green and blue (like the Nitecore SRT7), you might be worshiped as a god. On the other hand, if you took the same flashlight back to the late 1400s in Europe, you might be burned at the stake as an agent of Satan!

So look not for miracles, for as Jesus said, only the wicked and adulterous seek for a sign. The reason? By the way they lead their lives, they are not worthy of being led by the Holy Spirit and are consequently left unto themselves. So they constantly seek for miraculous signs to lead them.